From: "Greg Spencer" 
To: "Aussie Weather Mailing List" 
Subject: aussie-weather: BoM Radar Service
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 1998 21:41:06 +0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0
X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Hi All

For those of you who dont know, the BoM radar service is currently up for
free. Just go to the URL below and select which ever image suits your area

http://www.bom.gov.au/reguser/by_prod/radar

Regards

Greg Spencer

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Bureau's Warning Service...
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 98 02:14:12 +1000
X-Sender: mildad at mail.one.net.au
X-Mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1
From: mildad 
To: "aussie-weather" 
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

>I agree and disagree Paul.  I believe that yes, to an extent the BoM's
>warning service is fairly good.  However in many cases, severe t'storm
>warnings are not issued until after the worst of the t'storm!  Which
>really defeats the purpose.  In my opinion, the problem is that the BoM
>depends too much on radar, when really what they should be doing is
>using the best technology they have for 'nowcasting' - they're eyes.

I totally agree with Paul G - I think that the BoM warning service, at 
least from my experience in Sydney, is very good - the transfer of 
information to the general public, however (not at all the BoM's fault), 
is well... inconsistent. Although the BoM had a severe storm warning out 
for the storm we chased on Nov the 13th it was not broadcast on radio as 
a top priority where this sort of info is best disseminated (at least 
none of us heard it nor did any of my family or friends, ordinary people, 
who were in the path of that storm).  

I can't see that the BoM can rely 'too much' on radar Anthony as, from 
what I remember, the intensity of that Oct 13 storm was patently obvious 
on the radar loop I looked at - I really don't know what happened in that 
case.

Finally, regardless of how ignorant Australian people are with regard to 
the existence of tornadoes, I think that when a sustained hook echo is 
observed on radar or persistent rotating wall cloud observed by spotters, 
then surely a tornado watch (at the very least) should be issued. Since 
it is not possible to predict whether a mesocyclone will produce a 
tornado and if it does, how strong it will be, then the presence of this 
feature should be taken to indicate a very serious severe weather 
situation. Given the 'fairly' low frequency of such storms over major 
centres (not saying they should be the only ones warned), I don't think 
there should be too much concern over too many false alarms

Just my thoughts.

David

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 08:39:51 +1100
From: Anthony Cornelius 
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Bureau's Warning Service...
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Hi David,

Just a note about the Brisbane Oct 13 t'storms, to my knowledge, the
earliest warning was given out at 2:30pm.  The first thunderstorm damage
ocurred just after 11am.  Warwick got hit at 11:30am.  I don't think a
warning was issued before this, I've asked a few people and they said
the earliest they knew of the warning being published was 2:30pm.  But
perhaps I was wrong.  Does anyone else know if it was published earlier?
But the Brisbane BoM in the Good Friday t'storms didn't put a severe
t'storm warning on until after they had hit Ipswich, yet I knew they'd
probably be severe 90mins before the warning.

Anthony

mildad wrote:
> 
> >I agree and disagree Paul.  I believe that yes, to an extent the BoM's
> >warning service is fairly good.  However in many cases, severe t'storm
> >warnings are not issued until after the worst of the t'storm!  Which
> >really defeats the purpose.  In my opinion, the problem is that the BoM
> >depends too much on radar, when really what they should be doing is
> >using the best technology they have for 'nowcasting' - they're eyes.
> 
> I totally agree with Paul G - I think that the BoM warning service, at
> least from my experience in Sydney, is very good - the transfer of
> information to the general public, however (not at all the BoM's fault),
> is well... inconsistent. Although the BoM had a severe storm warning out
> for the storm we chased on Nov the 13th it was not broadcast on radio as
> a top priority where this sort of info is best disseminated (at least
> none of us heard it nor did any of my family or friends, ordinary people,
> who were in the path of that storm).
> 
> I can't see that the BoM can rely 'too much' on radar Anthony as, from
> what I remember, the intensity of that Oct 13 storm was patently obvious
> on the radar loop I looked at - I really don't know what happened in that
> case.
> 
> Finally, regardless of how ignorant Australian people are with regard to
> the existence of tornadoes, I think that when a sustained hook echo is
> observed on radar or persistent rotating wall cloud observed by spotters,
> then surely a tornado watch (at the very least) should be issued. Since
> it is not possible to predict whether a mesocyclone will produce a
> tornado and if it does, how strong it will be, then the presence of this
> feature should be taken to indicate a very serious severe weather
> situation. Given the 'fairly' low frequency of such storms over major
> centres (not saying they should be the only ones warned), I don't think
> there should be too much concern over too many false alarms
> 
> Just my thoughts.
> 
> David

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 14:05:42 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: Significant Weather, October..
Reply-Receipt: pgraham1 at extro.ucc.su.oz.au
Reply-Read: pgraham1 at mail.usyd.edu.au
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Significant Weather for October is out now: 
http://www.bom.gov.au/inside/services_policy/public/sigwxsum/sigw1098.shtml
Thought this looked interesting:  
"A reported tornado at Marrabel on the 17th to the north of Adelaide
caused an 8km long path of damage. High voltage power poles were twisted
and bent to ground level, 50 large river red gums were flattened and two
large cereal field bins were tossed 250 metres."

----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 14:58:10 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: Significant Weather, July...
Reply-Receipt: pgraham1 at extro.ucc.su.oz.au
Reply-Read: pgraham1 at mail.usyd.edu.au
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Perhaps this has been updated: 
(http://www.bom.gov.au/inside/services_policy/public/sigwxsum/sigw0798.shtml) 
"On the 27th at Willow Tree (North West Slopes) a tornado was reported
from Swinging Ridges road 12km southwest of Willow Tree.  Vehicles and a
weatherboard house were damaged and a baby was sucked out of the house." 


----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "James Chambers" 
To: "Aussie Weather" 
Subject: aussie-weather: Brisbane Storm Report
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 15:47:23 +1000
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Hi all

I just completed a storm report for November 18.
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~jourdey/storm/nov18_98.html
I have 4 photos from those storms - it was a spectacular gust front and lead
up to them.  Also there's a couple of storm spotter reports showing that it
may not have been that severe, but it certainly was spectacular!

Storms later tomorrow in Bris?

Cheers
------------------------------------------------------
James Chambers
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~jamestorm/bristorm.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: wbc at ozemail.com.au (Laurier Williams)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Significant Weather, July...
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 07:28:40 GMT
X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penman.es.mq.edu.au id SAA03701

On Sun, 29 Nov 1998 14:58:10 +1100 (EST), Paul Graham
 wrote:

>Perhaps this has been updated: 
>(http://www.bom.gov.au/inside/services_policy/public/sigwxsum/sigw0798.shtml) 
>"On the 27th at Willow Tree (North West Slopes) a tornado was reported
>from Swinging Ridges road 12km southwest of Willow Tree.  Vehicles and a
>weatherboard house were damaged and a baby was sucked out of the house." 
>
Paul, sorry to dash your hopes, but I have been watching the Bureau's
sig wx monthly summaries since their inception, and I have yet to see
any of them updated. 


-- 
Laurier Williams
Australian Weather Links and News
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~wbc/

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: wbc at ozemail.com.au (Laurier Williams)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Warnings/Forecasts by e-mail...
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 07:38:58 GMT
X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penman.es.mq.edu.au id SAA03716

On Fri, 27 Nov 1998 18:16:13 +1100 (EST), Paul Graham
 wrote:

>Hi everyone,
>	The Bureau of Meteorology is offering warnings and forecasts by
>e-mail as a trial service.  What do people think of the idea of
>subscribing the "Aussie-Weather" mailing list to this new, trial service?
>	What do you think Jacob?
>	- Paul G.
 I'd agree with those that say "don't"!

I've just got back to my computer after 5 days away, and am now
working through 100 aussie-weather emails......


-- 
Laurier Williams
Australian Weather Links and News
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~wbc/